Global Conflict

Evil_Jocey wrote:

Chefcook wrote:Doublepost:

Armor Guy: Not be able to leave main base, because of constant SOFLAM spots (and javelins) is a frustrating "i want to do something else than play GC-BF3" moment.

And the armour guy can see the lasers and report their positions in. => Use Teamspeak.

What is really more frustrating is when you are in cover with your tank (like beneath the trees on Caspian) and a jet can still take you out with a long range rocket pod attack. Because he saw the tank-dorito, nothing else. Especially these long range attacks are really frustrating. Yes, rocket pods got nerfed... and jets can still take out tanks with ease. The doritos just make it easier to kill targets on a range where you can't even see the pixels of the enemy, and that is why i voted against 3-D spotting.

Good luck on shooting down that soflam with bullets, it'll be even harder when you don't know where it exactly is. BF3 was designed to have 3D-Spotting, i really don't think it's going to be fun for either armor or air without it. Infantry will be awesome for sure, but vehicles...

Chefcook wrote:Then imagine that:

You have done everything perfectly right. You are sneaking with your squad around to your objective. Then a pesky camping sniper is hiding between two rocks with his perfect camo. He is shooting one of your buddys. He is spotting and telling via Teamspeak where he is. (between the rocks)

My feelings in that situation is great one less enemy at the flags, and if he is using a sniperscoop its easy (as infantry) to locate him by the glair, and take him out with my trusted LMG or send gwynzer to knife him

LoA wrote:Good luck on shooting down that soflam with bullets, it'll be even harder when you don't know where it exactly is. BF3 was designed to have 3D-Spotting, i really don't think it's going to be fun for either armor or air without it. Infantry will be awesome for sure, but vehicles...

This. Even in the helo it really takes a tv missile to guarantee you'll take down the soflam.

As I mentioned on TS yesterday as well...mobile AA will be extremely difficult to deal with with 3d off. The AA has such incredible range and power now that even when I know exactly where it is (with it's dorrito above it so I can engage from extremely long distances) I have trouble killing it. With 3d off it will be next to invisible. Yeah yeah I know, call it out over TS if you're good enough at comms you should be able to locate it. He'll either move, or it won't make a difference because I won't be able to hit him from far enough away because I can't precisely locate him.

I'm all for turning off 3d spotting so long as we can find a way to not completely nurf air to the point of being unusable. My personal opinion is that if air is a little overpowered thats not the worst thing in the world. Air is overpowered. That's why trillions (yes with a "T") of dollars are spent developing new planes and over $4 billion a pop is spent on aircraft carriers. That's why in BF3 there are only 2 jets and 1 or 2 helos. I understand it's frustrating to get killed by a jet as infantry. I think for the way we play 3d spotting does effect more than our original intent of combating soflams.

Put me in the camp of wanting 3d spotting off, but until we can come up with a good solution to the air issue I'm fine with it on.

Just an opinion but air can still be of use. It is not like you will be totally useless right? you may not get you high KDR but every version of this game air has been a powerful tool. With 3D off you can still spot things for all to see though it takes effort. I personally do not see why it is a good thing to just show up on the map because I am there and not because someone noticed me.

I do agree on the SOFLAM as I was the one to bring up turning 3D spoting on after camp one. My issue was you could not spot it like you can spot say a tank with 3D off.

A test of the settings is needed so be sure to show up for that.

Anyway JMO.

AA is a problem at the moment thanks to DICEs wonderful decision to buff it last patch to ridiculous heights. It should be reeled back in next patch (DICE have a trend of over compensating then pulling back a patch or two later) so it's not such a big issue.

Tanks are fine without 3D spotting, those SOFLAMs are much easier to see now than they were in C1 as they are much brighter. At the end of the last campaign I couldn't put a SOFLAM up without it going down in seconds, minutes at max. If you have a problematic SOFLAM with 3D spotting off then I believe with the current ability to see their bright lights you should be able to take it out with a counter SOFLAM and Javelin quite quickly. That will be easier than in C1 IMO after the patches changed how bright the SOFLAMs are.

Not sure why soflams are such a big issue to everyone, you can use MAV to take it out.

Friends, peers, fellow homo erectus is this really an issue of funny dots on the screen or is it more about allowing ourselves the freedom to reach higher levels of communication and teamwork without the use of cheap and unrealistic in game peripherals that hint of nubsauce?

BushMaster wrote:Friends, peers, fellow homo erectus is this really an issue of funny dots on the screen or is it more about allowing ourselves the freedom to reach higher levels of communication and teamwork without the use of cheap and unrealistic in game peripherals that hint of nubsauce?

Hear hear!

.Sup wrote:Not sure why soflams are such a big issue to everyone, you can use MAV to take it out.

I was about to post this too. I don't get the worry about SOFLAMs. Really easy to take up a MAV, FC will probably be in one anyway.

+ you could finally use spec op squads to take them out, I find no better and more exciting assignment for such squads. Destroy the soflam, take recon's tags, place C4 on their vehicles and sneak out of enemy territory...

LoA wrote:BF3 was designed to have 3D-Spotting, i really don't think it's going to be fun for either armor or air without it. Infantry will be awesome for sure, but vehicles...

And I can equally say BF3 was designed to not have 3D spotting. Its been an option since launch.
After C1, I was all for not allowing Soflams which created one less reason to play the sniper class. Tanks and helos can still paint, also Javelins can still lock without. Then it turned into fix it with turning 3D spotting on which imo made gameplay worse. I agree that vehicles will have a harder time, I disagree that turning 3D spotting back on is the answer.

A reasonable compromise would be not allowing Soflams and disabling 3D spotting. Infantry can't use Soflams while air vehicles would have to try harder without 3D spotting. Just a thought.

BushMaster wrote:Friends, peers, fellow homo erectus is this really an issue of funny dots on the screen or is it more about allowing ourselves the freedom to reach higher levels of communication and teamwork without the use of cheap and unrealistic in game peripherals that hint of nubsauce?

It's a bath of nubsauce. 3d spotting is a crutch instituted by the great architects to pander to the masses. Being able to engage and kill someone solely off a HUD blip from 300m away without ever actually seeing them is ridiculous. Terribles don't get any better and it is much easier for good players to dominate. 3 ceases to be a fps and becomes some trashy, flash, point and click puzzle game with 3d spotting. I might as well go play bejeweled.

They have a name for features similar to this in other FPS, wallhacks. Generally you get banned for those.

BushMaster wrote:of cheap and unrealistic in game peripherals that hint of nubsauce?

Not to nit pick, but your concept of realism is skewed. 3D spotting is based loosely on the latest version of the Landwarrior system, which has been deployed in Iraq and used to great effect. Basically the only difference is the 3D spotting in Battlefield 3 has an automatic refresh built into it, whereas Landwarrior requires manual updates for enemy locations.

I'm okay with turning 3D spotting off and keeping soflams off the table. That would make laser-painting with Helo's and MBTs much more valuable. It would also allow for sneaky ninja maneuvers, which are always fun.

It would be an effective military tool to randomly spam spots and have an orange dorito attached to a hostiles head that everyone can see.